bishop rotary

[fsandoval]

Does anyone know how I can get a replacement front spring asap for my bishop mine broke a couple of days ago and Im really lost with out that machine ...

[Administrator]

949-916-1054 This is the contact number for Bishop, whoever answers should be able to help you. It might be Franco or his Wife?

[JCarlton]

you don't need the spring to tattoo with it. I am sure Franco will take care of you but don't put it up just because of the return spring.

[Gabetexas]

Franco is the man at getting shit repaired/parts. Im happy i got mine back!

[JayFatInk]

any hardware store you can get that spring....

[fkirons]

most rotaries work better without the front spring. Less motor load, smoother performance, but yes 4 out of 10 times the needle will stay out when the motor stops.

[G.Graves]

you don't need the spring to tattoo with it. I am sure Franco will take care of you but don't put it up just because of the return spring. I wonder if he used the machine after this NEWS FLASH:) ah man, could of used it for the last month.......

[drewsifer247]

The bishop was my first rotary tattoo machine, the quality is great, the hand pains gone, and cuts my tattoo time in half.

I use my bishop with disposable vortex tubes from tat soul they compliment each other and work harder to make your life tattooing easier....

[JCarlton]

I wonder if he used the machine after this NEWS FLASH:) ah man, could of used it for the last month....... Ha! He did say he was lost without it so you never know!

[Inkslingers]

The bishop was my first rotary tattoo machine, the quality is great, the hand pains gone, and cuts my tattoo time in half.

I use my bishop with disposable vortex tubes from tat soul they compliment each other and work harder to make your life tattooing easier....

Sounds like a marketing ad...lol...

[flatline]

Whats the quality of the motor in the bishop? I've heard some negative results from a couple of artist's at the last convention. Are they not maxon motor?

[OwlsDen]

Not maxon from what I understand they are the same as the Neo Tat uses I believe Mabuchi ( spelling ) Japanese Motor. I could be wrong but if you search the forum you will find the answer.

[flatline]

I did a quick search. Kind of a bummer. I really wanted to get one or a neo tat. I can't bring myself to spend that much on something like that.

[OwlsDen]

I wouldn't knock it, maxon isn't the only good manufacture out there. Also if you need a replacement a lot of the maxon motors are hella expensive, and that is based on the price in euro. I can guess at how Insane it would be in dollars. The motors in the Neo Tat and I believe the Bishop are only about 15-30$ you can afford to have a few back ups. Not to mention that both of those companies are renowned for Great! Customer support.

[Administrator]

Bishop currently uses Maubuchi ( rumured they are switching to maxon), depending on the drive system some motors are better then others. Maubuchi is used by almost half the popular rotary builders on the market and they are virtually indestructible. The other common motors are maxon and fualber, the big difference is the weight of the motor. Faulber makes the lightest most expensive motor but its very particular about the drive system it uses. maxon makes light motors as well but they can in some cases not perform as well if the drive system does not work well with it. The mariachi is kind of like a tank, ugly and heavy but its a real workhorse.

I know many of the builders on here personally and know a lot about the machines they make and can tell you that many of them have spent hundreds if not thousands buying motors to test them with the unique drive system they each use. Beyond the brand name its also a matter of testing the hell out of multiple models of motors from the same manufacturer to make sure you have something that will perform the way you want and not die after 1000 hours. The other issue is many artists will simply complain about a machine and blame the motor, this is like blaming the coils on a relay machine when there are a dozen other things that could be the issue including the artist them self's.

[OwlsDen]

That is the best explanation you will get anywhere. Don't rate a machine on one part no matter how critical that part might be. Go with a machine that feels right, not which one uses the most expensive motor.

[flatline]

I see your points. They have some truth. Even though a bit bias. i know that costs have to be covered, however, these machines are being sold worldwide. High production levels at a cost of 350 plus. I think its an insult to the market to design a build over availability. Just cause everyone does it, doesn't make it right. Shouldn't their be some worth to the machine that separates it from a knock off? Besides a few parts which can be easily upgraded? I'm all about paying a man for his hard work and investments. At some point their should be a balance of its worth. Their may be artist's out their that abuse machines and complain unreasonably. I've just heard some complaints from some pretty reputable people that had me questioning the purchase of one myself. Had another machine builder that bought one and disected it to learn that their was in fact a cheap motor at the helm. I had my doubts on believing it at first, so that's why I've been looking into it before making a decision. I spend a good anount of money all the time so I can offer the best product I can. I'm not gonna charge somebody 200 for a 150 dollar tattoo, and then dilute my inks.

[OwlsDen]

I think you will find testimony that the decision was not monetary but the choice in the cheaper motor was for worked better and more reliably with the system in the machine. I understand where you are coming from, but in the case of the Neo Tat original it sells for 250$ a price I think is a bargain. The bishop is 290€ I don't know the price in dollars so I can't compare that. Also unless you know all of Maxon's motor systems don't be too quick to believe they are the best. Maxon makes cheap motors too I think they start around 20€. Graupner is a German company makes nice motors and they range from 6€-400€ it isn't all in a name. The only Maxon motor replacement I know is the Swiss machine has it listed on their site for 125€ but I imagine it is more like 90€ direct from maxon. I know I have bought coil machines for over 300$ because of a name I trusted, and this can be strange going to rotaries as the names are all newer and use motors that they don't produce. Don't use this as a vehicle to discount the hard work that they put in to the design, testing and production of these rotaries. It most likely costs a lot more to make these machines than coil machines. I think we are lucky that there are companies with reasonable prices. Besides you have a whole group of people her eager to try new things and most anyone here will buy what you don't like. Either to try something new or to have two of the same machine for easier setup and workflow.

[Alie K]

I see your points. They have some truth. Even though a bit bias. i know that costs have to be covered, however, these machines are being sold worldwide. High production levels at a cost of 350 plus. I think its an insult to the market to design a build over availability. Just cause everyone does it, doesn't make it right. Shouldn't their be some worth to the machine that separates it from a knock off? Besides a few parts which can be easily upgraded? I'm all about paying a man for his hard work and investments. At some point their should be a balance of its worth. Their may be artist's out their that abuse machines and complain unreasonably. I've just heard some complaints from some pretty reputable people that had me questioning the purchase of one myself. Had another machine builder that bought one and disected it to learn that their was in fact a cheap motor at the helm. I had my doubts on believing it at first, so that's why I've been looking into it before making a decision. I spend a good anount of money all the time so I can offer the best product I can. I'm not gonna charge somebody 200 for a 150 dollar tattoo, and then dilute my inks.

Perhaps I'm not understanding what exactly you are asking in this thread. I'm also not sure why you think some of the members who answered your previous postings have biased opinions. If anything, the fact that they own the machines in question should help to verify that they are confident in what they say about these machines.

Things that seperate the Original Neotat and Original Bishop from the knockoff versions:

-Made/assembled in America

-Customer service available - Both Franco and Ray are more than happy to either repair or replace machines depending on what is necessary

-Will actually last you for an entire day of hard tattooing without shitting the bed

Maybe I'm reading your post wrong, but I don't think that a machine in the $280-$350 price range is an exorbitant amount of money to spend on a machine. The $600 machines have had a fair amount of research and development put into them, and though they may be out of some artist's price ranges, they are specialty machines, some of them are even handmade by one person start to finish - brazing, filing, etc. and that comes with a price tag.

There is a big difference between a Kia and a Mercedes for a reason. Both will get you from point a to point b, but if reliability, the little luxuries and attention to details are what you are after, you will choose accordingly.

Off the top of my head, these machines are made with Maxon motors. If having a Maxon motor is your deciding factor for getting a machine, get one of these:
Blitz
Dragonfly
Swash
Stigma
Ben Wight
(any others I missed?)

At the end of the day, you're going to do what you want with your money. I see that you own a Stealth (Swiss knockoff). It runs a generic motor. The only difference in those machines is NOT the motor. I really don't see your point complaining about machines that cost more than Chinese knockoffs, and expecting a name-brand motor to fix its shortcomings.

[flatline]

Fair points. I've leaned a lot more towards Neo because of the price as well. Not to beat a dead horse though, but I think I have read Bishop is going to maxon motors. I think their is a reason for that. Either way, you do make a very valid point though. They are in high demand, and if I feel I need to move them, I feel strongly that I can! Thanks for the feed back. And understanding view.

[flatline]

Alie K. I respect your opinion, but your out of line with your understanding on this. The difference between a stealth is the price. Plain and simple. I'm not trying to buy a machine to fix any shortcomings. I'm just venturing into the world of rotaries more cause I have seen the heal times and consistency, and am always trying to try new things. I like to know what I'm investing in. I'm not that foolish with my money to just spend without learning about it first. This is something that I learned that didn't sit well with. Get over it. I think we are all adults here. Your attitude on this one isn't very cool.

[OwlsDen]

I think it would be nice to have a chart of machines and the motors that they use as a compare contrast. But I would definitely vote for it to be a members only list. For instance I have a Treasure Chest and only know that it uses a German motor. I have assumed Fullhaeber or Graupner but this is an assumption.

As for attitudes, I think you have just gotten a wrong impression from the written word in contrast to the spoken one. It is difficult to ascertain intention and emotion from the written word and sometimes we read animosity where there is none. I am fairly certain that Allie is just trying to help. I don't think she is giving you any attitude.

[flatline]

Perhaps.Maybe I just read it wrong. Sorry if I misunderstood. It is hard to judge tone and context over a keyboard. I have a small fortune in machines. Just like to know what I'm getting. I feel like the thread is getting a bit hijacked now, so I'll end by saying thanks for all the feed back, and perhaps will try one myself one day.

[Alie K]

The difference between a stealth [and Swiss Machine] is the price. Plain and simple.

Do any machine builders care to comment on this statement? I'd really love to hear your replies.

[hendricksonart.com]

the stealth motor lacks some serious power

[flatline]

Once again Alie, you have sadly misunderstood. And in return, you have decided to rewrite my sentence with Swiss Machine in quotations. Whats you angle? the meaning of my statement was simply to state that the difference of the stealth was the price difference which made it reasonable to try out. I paid 130 for it about a year or so ago, which seemed reasonable to try out during a time when rotaries where gaining popularity. Does that make sense? It still runs fine to this day and has become a product that I have found to be reliable. I wanted to check out some of these that have higher price tags to see what makes them 100-200% more in value. That's it.Not much else to say about it.

[Administrator]

I doubt there is any angle or bias.

The Stealth is made in china so the labor costs associated with the manufacture of this machine are lower than a machine made in Europe or the US. For some the stealth is a great workhorse, for others it has proven to be an under powered poorly constructed introduction to rotary machines. There are probably a hundred members of this forum who have at least one rattling around in their drawer and its neglected. I have seen the drive shaft on the stealth motor seize, the bearings ground to dust, the chuck bend... all within about a year of use. Sure it paid for its self however when you pay more you get more. Good coil machines start at $250 and easily double from there. You can buy an FK irons knock off from world wide as a simple introduction to a tattoo machine but it will still not be worth the copper wrapped around the coil cores after only a few hours of work with it.

[fkirons]

Do any machine builders care to comment on this statement? I'd really love to hear your replies.
Sure...Fuc# the Stealth. Support originality and quality.

[The Limey]

Alie K. I respect your opinion, but your out of line with your understanding on this. The difference between a stealth is the price. Plain and simple. I'm not trying to buy a machine to fix any shortcomings. I'm just venturing into the world of rotaries more cause I have seen the heal times and consistency, and am always trying to try new things. I like to know what I'm investing in. I'm not that foolish with my money to just spend without learning about it first. This is something that I learned that didn't sit well with. Get over it. I think we are all adults here. Your attitude on this one isn't very cool.

Not at all, there are some major differences in both build and part quality period. Go and take a peek in the top drawer forum and look at what Alie actually owns and uses, she's not miss understanding anything at all, just simply stating that you get what you pay for period including customer service.

[fsandoval]

Thanks every one I continued to use it with out the spring and still using it without. I now have 3 of these machines I had to send one back for repairs anyone know the turn around time to get one fixed. Sent it on november 16th I understand that they are busy and things take time. But I've seen on other post that they are usually really fast at getting machines back.

[Gabetexas]

took about 3 1/2 weeks for mine.

[FRANCO VESCOVI]

Whats the quality of the motor in the bishop? I've heard some negative results from a couple of artist's at the last convention. Are they not maxon motor?

to answer some questions about my motor, we are using only Maxon brand motors as of 10/20/2011 for reasons that are open for debate. My personal experience/opinion is that the Mabuchi motors are overall a nice product especially for the price, withoiut question and in no way am I putting down any builder that uses them.

To be honest, even if one has to replace a 20$ motor or a 75$ motor once every few years that is far more superior than the days of wasted time spent adjusting coils or replacing springs, screws and capacitors constantly. I have also had my fair share if issues with them such as inconsistancy and a few other issues too lengthy to discuss. There is a researchable reason that they are inexpensive and also the Maxon motors are more expensive for real good researchable reasons. I have met in person and had lengthy discussion with Mr. Watabe from Mabuchi and also met with Jeff at Maxon and my overall opinion (and this is just my opinion) from my research is that I am choosing to spend the extra money and use Maxon from now on. I have had motor issues and have also replaced or fixed for free any issue that was brought to my attention as Plenty will agree. So as you can imagine spending thousands on UPS and new motors , I had to dig deep and figure this out..part of the learning/growing experience. I have tried several Maxon motors and have found the one that has the overall stall torque and millinewton meters that are efficient enough to be used in the tattoo application with my machine and spring tension of choice. Any questions feel free to contact me. Thanx

[FRANCO VESCOVI]

Thanks every one I continued to use it with out the spring and still using it without. I now have 3 of these machines I had to send one back for repairs anyone know the turn around time to get one fixed. Sent it on november 16th I understand that they are busy and things take time. But I've seen on other post that they are usually really fast at getting machines back.

Hey there Mr. Sandoval, Sorry for the time spent repairing your machine, we sent it to you the other day so you should receive it any day with your problem resolved and some more lube as well as spare springs.

[fsandoval]

Hey there Mr. Sandoval, Sorry for the time spent repairing your machine, we sent it to you the other day so you should receive it any day with your problem resolved and some more lube as well as spare springs.
No problem I completely understand you are extremely busy I got the machine back friday morning and its running great thanks again