give question

I see that the dragonfly says 3.5 to 5mm stroke and see that it has one set stroke length.. but the stroke lengthens to create give. Hyper v3 also seems to open the throw and not reduce the stoke as give is created.
Then I see the Neds and it is a spring on top which would actually shorten the stroke as the give effects the hit. Also the RotaryWorks springer is the same.. the stroke compacts as give is created.

So from this am I right to assume that the actual nipple end is allowed to increase its radius of play on the DF and v3? and is not fixed in place like the rw and neds?
The ego has this play were the nipple is free to move up and down softened by the rubber triangles, thus increasing the total thrown at least a mm.

Just curious if anyone is knowledgeable about how these two give systems work? Or am I correct in my assumption?
Because in my honest opinion softening a machine's hit by allowing the stroke to widen by speed and or losing it with a twist of a screw seems to be a more effective give system.
Just as any machine that tries to create give by merely allowing the nipple to give under a spring, without increasing throw is still a direct drive.. its just a direct drive with give..
I don't know if there is a name for the dragonfly style of give system, i would call it an open drive machine.

Please feel free to speak your mind..

that is a great question.lol and i have know idea of the answer.lol..

anyone else... i mean this is a serious question..

The spring in the give holds the nipple down on to the top of the piston. As you increase the give it allows the nipple to move upwards off the top of the piston as the machine runs increasing the stroke.

It wouldn't be considered a direct drive with give the v3 is a swash system with a Delrin rocker. Direct is cam bolted to a motor spindle. 2 best give systems in my opinion are the inkjecta s3 and the hyper v3

never said the v3 was a DD .. RW and Neds are direct drive...
what i am saying is that some machines were the nipple is fixed in place cannot increase the throw, its impossible.. like the RW conrad or bishop..
but the dragon fly and v3 both increase throw ,, so their nipple cannot be fixed in place it has to have some form of linear freedom in the nipple head.. that is why they can increase the stoke length...
the ego is the perfect example... the nipple head is free to move against the rubber and actually increase the total stroke length.. creating dampening of pressure.. hence give.
so in conclusion some machines have what i would call an open drive.. and the others are direct drive, but some of these direct drives can be softened a little but at the expense, or reduction of stoke length.

make more sense? so the point i am making is that it would be nice to have the give system listed when ordering different rotaries, so you know what kind of give system it has, if any.

Sorry I assumed you were talking about the v3 as well being a DD. you can also decrease the stroke in a slider system with a fixed armature post by spring tension, especially at lower volts, whether it has just a stay up spring or also a spring in back within the adjustment knob setup. I think it would be hard for a builder to classify what type of give system is at work because so many are mechanically slightly different from one another. Take the halo, v3 and inkjecta for example. All have adjustment knobs but work very differently. I just think it would be hard to say open drive when that classification could result in a similar setup mechanically but a different result in how the give actually works. If you back a halos give knob out to full give it will back off slightly with lighter pressure on the armature post, but put more pressure and it almost clicks back into a mm and a half of needle give. This reactions is unique in any give system I have experienced even with similar fixed post adjustment knob setups.

Basically as oppose to listing the type of give system it would be nice if builders had videos of the machines running loaded, and showing the give system at work with finger pressure on the armature post. That would show exactly how it gives and negate the need for labeling them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MickWrath

Basically as oppose to listing the type of give system it would be nice if builders had videos of the machines running loaded, and showing the give system at work with finger pressure on the armature post. That would show exactly how it gives and negate the need for labeling them.

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i agree with this as well is its nice if they have good audio on these and no bogus backround music, that way we can hear jus how the needle gives when hittin the skin. also some of the videos they seem to put a ton of pressure on the nipple way harder than we wood ever contact skin during tattoo. i like to see a realistic amount of pressure, great audio, variety of volts, and clear close ups to how the needle retracts when pressure is applied. not asking much lolool

I agree ..